ILUKA is easily one of Australia’s most emotive singer-songwriters – bringing feelings to the forefront amid her hazy retro-pop bops.
However, her latest single with Lime Cordiale, Mess, marks a shiny, bouncy evolution for ILUKA both sonically and lyrically as an ode to the chaos that ILUKA once called her regular reality – alongside Lime Cordiale’s Louis and Oli Leimbach.
In light of this impressive release, as well as ILUKA’s upcoming gig at The Vanguard in Sydney, Happy got the chance to sit down with ILUKA to chat about burnt-out cars, collaborating across the seas, and replacing therapy, with songwriting.
HAPPY: So, firstly, Mess is absolutely gorgeous! I’ve read that it’s about youth and reckless abandonment, but I’m wondering if there’s a specific memory that you’re drawing from?
ILUKA: Yeah! It’s funny you ask that! I’ve known the Lime guys for years, especially Louis, he used to live up the road from me, and I was living in a warehouse at the time. It was this really beautiful time of just… exploring, and being quite reckless and quite wild (laughs).
I think, as much as it was a beautiful time, it quite a reckless and unhinged time. It’s funny, when we were writing the verses, we were talking about that time when we…
(Zoom call cuts out)
HAPPY: Okay. So you were talking about the fact that it was a really reckless, unhinged time in your life, essentially with you and the Lime Cordiale guys.
ILUKA: Yeah. So just being super young and, um, hanging out with Louis a lot when we were drawing… when we were writing the verses for this song, we were kind of drawing upon like specific images of during that time. And so, I was living in this amazing warehouse and… and we’d always have artists over, drawing on the walls. And it was really beautiful. Like it was, we were trying to kind of pull out these images we could use. And one of his lines is ‘the photo clicks on top of a burnt-out car’, and he’s actually referencing a photograph that we had, this like burnt-out car pretty much on the street that I was living on. And there’s this one specific photograph of me and another few friends, like standing on this car. Justin is like outrageous.
And that was like the, yeah, just those images we wanted to draw upon to kind of create this really nostalgic… I think we were like, yeah, super young with these really big dreams, and obviously like the Lime Cordiale guys were just starting out, and I was also just starting out, and um, like sharing all these experiences of like wanting to… to… to be a musician, and make it big. And, um, this, yeah, like quite beautiful, but also, you know, very unsustainable time. Kind of, yeah. Nostalgic, and um, yeah, just create this image, pulling upon those specific images we kind of shared together during that time. Um, which is yeah. What we did.
HAPPY: Yeah. It’s funny because Mess has that feeling throughout it. Am I reading into that, or is that sort of also a vibe that you think is present?
ILUKA: Totally. The nostalgia and tapping into that.
HAPPY: Yeah.
ILUKA: Yeah, absolutely. I’m like the most nostalgic person now. I feel like I’m a young person trapped in like an old person’s… soul. Sorry, I meant I have a young person’s body… Other way round.
HAPPY: I was going to say, I was like, ‘what?’
ILUKA: Other way round. So I’m like, very nostalgic. And I love being able to go back to memories that are… that time in my life was such an important time, and it was so its own thing. And I love being able to tap into that and draw upon that kind of well, because I have like – not lived so many different lives, but I’ve kind of had all these like beautiful experiences, and to be able to tap into those and really go there, and draw upon that nostalgia, as bittersweet as it is, I think is something I definitely, definitely do. And being able to do that with someone who experienced that time with me, which we Louis did, was really cool. Um, so I think we both kind of yeah, went there, and although it was – I’m so glad I’m not living it now. Like it’s beautiful being able to have that memory, and it’s not painful in the fact that it’s over, but you kind of acknowledge the beauty of that time, and um, I think that’s what that nostalgia is all about.
HAPPY: Yeah. I think it’s always funny how during the times that you look back at most fondly in your life, tended to be the worst in a way?
ILUKA: Mmm, the most destructive. Yeah, but oftentimes, beautiful.
HAPPY: Yeah. And I guess, you and the Lime Cordiale guys were sort of going through this time together. So, I guess like the creation process of this must’ve been a lot more – I want to say easy, but I also feel like maybe cathartic?
ILUKA: Yeah, totally. I think, um, when the song was first… the first bits of it, I kind of came up with that chorus. Um, and that actually, that first line, ‘I confess that I’m a fucking mess’ was kind of the first thing that I solidly like held onto, and was like, ‘Oh, this could be cool for a song.’ And um, it’s funny, like when I was singing that, the person that I sort of – and I’ve told him this – the person I thought of was Louis, because I was like ‘Oh, this could be really cool.’ I guess it was like parking on this very messy, maybe turbulent time, and immediately I was like, ‘Oh, I know someone who could help me draw this out.’ So yeah, I think it was a cathartic experience. And I think, um, yeah, again, just being able to share that time, like write about a time that you both experienced was really cool. So yeah. Was that kind of the question?
HAPPY: Yeah. Yeah. I did the deep dive of your sort of like music catalogue last night. There’s a definite sonic evolution compared to some of the stuff you made before versus Mess. And I just like, I can’t put my finger on it, but maybe you can shed some light on what you’ve done differently this time.
ILUKA: Yeah, totally. I think this time, I think the producer has been a huge, um, I think I’ll call it a step up because he’s, um, basically my dream producer. Very excited to have him on board, and we have been working together now for a little while. And he’s doing all my next bunch of work, and I kind of really feel like I found a partner in, um, music, even though he’s on the other side of the world. It’s only via, um, Zoom that we get to make music. But, um, I think he was definitely a big part of Mess, which is the first song that I’ve put out with him producing it. Um, so I think that’s a big part of it. I think also that the year before COVID – um, so what was it, 2019? Um, I was in America for most of the year, kind of writing, um, pretty much for my most of the year with different songwriters and producers and, um, kind of went back and forth between Nashville and LA.
I do think that, that even though Mess wasn’t written in that time, a lot of the songs I’m about to release were, um, written in America. Um, but I think that time was probably the most significant for me as an artist and songwriter – like again, I think it was just working with amazing people who really pushing me, um, to like get all the nitty-gritty things and just to say what I really want to say, and just doing it as frequently as I was doing it. I mean, songwriting is like a craft, right? You’ve got to keep honing in on it. Um, and I think that year specifically was yeah, very significant to my songwriting and evolution as an artist, and being able to take all the experiences that I’d had in the years leading up – um, you know, whether it was heartbreak or… and actually like being able to articulate them for the first time. Um, so that as well. That, and then yeah, working with Aaron – Aaron Forms, which is, um, yeah, specifically this is the first release with him. I think it’s, um, yeah, hopefully pushed… pushed me.
HAPPY: Yeah. I’ve got two split off things that I now want to ask because of that. You’ve talked about some writing as a craft that you sort of have to hone in, and I guess I want to ask, like, what do you reckon makes good song writing?
ILUKA: Ooh, I think firstly experiences. I think you can’t write a beautiful heartfelt, maybe painful, maybe happy song without experiencing that yourself. And so yeah, I think experience in whatever form that is. Um, secondly, I think yeah, working at it and honing in on your craft. I’ve written so many shit songs over the years, that I can only now write a good song because of all the very bad songs that I’ve written. So, I think it’s like an idea in people’s heads that they’re going to like start writing, and write this amazing song, but it’s like, ‘No, no, no, you’re gonna write so many that hopefully no one will ever listen to before you write a good song.’ Um, I think getting really – again, it comes back to the experience – but being able to pull out those experiences, and articulate them in a way that other people can grab onto.
Like, there’s… I know Patty Smith talks about it a lot. She’s one of my main, um, muses, I guess. And she often talks about like, going into that creative space – whatever you call it that, like that creative pool or unconscious world. Um, and you’ve got to pull all this kind of stuff from there, but then bring it back to the physical world, where you’ve gotta be able to then put that into a form that people can relate to and understand. So it’s… it’s all well and good going into those spaces, and, um, but you’ve kind of got to learn how to bring all that magic, that experience, that creative fuel back into a physical place in a form that people can relate to. And yeah, I think that’s what every artist is trying to do, whether that’s through a song, or through a painting… but that’s definitely what I, yeah, try to do with songwriting, like be really raw and real, and just pull at that experience until it’s… Um, I mean, it’s great therapy. Songwriters don’t need therapists, we’re our own therapist. So yeah, that’s funny to me.
HAPPY: Um, and then I want to go on to that question of sort of like collaborating with someone who’s literally like on the other side of the world. I guess, how do you do it, what are the intricacies around it? Everyone has a different method.
ILUKA: Yeah, it was pretty weird at first to be honest. So 2020, I was meant to be back in America, um, working with different people, and obviously, COVID happened, so I had to stay in Australia as you know, as happened to most people, um, in terms having to change plans. And so, it was my label that suggested like just starting to do… you’ll do co-writes and stuff, but over Zoom. And I thought it was a pretty weird concept at first, but I don’t know. Once you get beyond the whole screen thing, that you’re not actually in the same room, if you get along with the person and it works… it’s just like, you know, if you’re in a room and you don’t energetically work with someone, it doesn’t work. It doesn’t work on zoom, and it doesn’t work in real life. So it’s still, if there’s someone that you collaborate well with, you’re going to collaborate well with them, even on Zoom. So yeah, I think it was, yeah, a really cool process of just being still able to work with the people I wanted to work within. It would have been a dream if I could have done it in person, but like, we can’t do that. And I was still able to yeah, work with all the people that I wanted to work with, and especially, yeah, work with the producer that I wanted to work with. Um, so yeah, it’s been a – for the most part – a really cool experience, and nothing will ever replace in person, um, when you’re in creation mode, but it’s an amazing alternative.
HAPPY: Yeah. I guess, I also want to talk about the Mess music video, just because the aesthetic is SO GOOD. Do you know, I love this sort of like psychedelic energy it has, but like, it’s definitely in that sort of like left-field of psychedelia. I just want to know the inspo. Where did it come from? How was it formed?
ILUKA: Yeah. So, yeah, I’m very visually, um, a part of all the music videos, just because I’m very visual person. I love fashion and style. Yeah. Fashion and fashion world stuff. So I wanted, yeah, I kind of had these strong images from very early on in the picture, with the song. It’s kind of… so like for me it’s big, bold, vibrant colors. Like, that’s the energy it always gave me. And by chance, my, one of my best friends had just moved into this converted church in the Blue Mountains. So that’s what the space was.
HAPPY: Right.
ILUKA: A converted church, she’d literally just moved in, and I visited her, and it’s like this Wes Anderson – just super eccentric, like everything you see in the video, like that is what the house looks like. It’s all one house, all those different rooms, the stage, it’s all this one converted church. And yeah, basically I visited her, and it was kind of helping her move in, and I was like, ‘Oh my God, we got to shoot something in this magical place.’ And it just made sense with the song, and the kind of colours of the place and, um, yeah, kind of drawing on the, yeah, the Wes Anderson vibe and a lot of, um, the kind of Gucci short films, like style-wise. Um, eccentric and, um, just vibrant and fun. Um, so that, yeah, that was the kind of inspiration behind… I’m trying to think of the director that does all those Gucci short films. But anyway, that, that was there. That was the inspiration behind it.
HAPPY: Yeah. Um, I just sort of wanted to ask, I do have to ask this, but I guess, like you said… you mentioned before about upcoming projects, things you’re planning to release. Can you give us any hints, anything… a bit of insider moment on that?
ILUKA: I’m trying to think what I can say and what I can’t say! Um, I can’t say the thing that I want to say, so I’m going to say… um, so I’m going to say there’s another single that’s all ready to go that’s coming very soon.
HAPPY: OK.
ILUKA: Um, and then there’s a lot more that’s being worked on currently. And um, even for me, it’s… yeah. A big deal, what’s kind of coming if… yeah. There’s lots… there’s lots coming. Aaron and I have been very busy working on a bunch of stuff, but yes, next single coming very soon, and then a whole lot more music coming with that too.
HAPPY: Yesssssss.
ILUKA: Sorry. That was my weird like, I’m not gonna say.
HAPPY: That went really well, I really liked that. You said everything and nothing.
ILUKA: Yeah. That was my plan.
HAPPY: This has been like, lovely, I guess like my final thing is, do you have anything you want to add in, or anything that I haven’t touched upon that you think is important?
ILUKA: Um, no, not really. No.
HAPPY: Well, I’ll keep an eye out for that new single.
ILUKA: Um… oh, oh, oh, oh! I thought of something. I have a launch show that I should definitely announce. I have a show on June 19 – a Sydney show – that will be announced in the next day to essentially like… the launch for Mess. Should be fun!
HAPPY: Cute! Actually, this isn’t going to go in the interview, but um, you’re in Sydney right now, right?
ILUKA: Yeah.
HAPPY: How are you faring out with the whole lockdown Sydney-sitch?
ILUKA: I know. It’s just like, you can’t have more than 20 people.
HAPPY: I feel like the other states are going to be like ‘No, border closed!’
ILUKA: And that one guy that went to literally went to four Barbecue shops!
HAPPY: I know, I love that thing, it was like, it’s like a man in his fifties. And it’s like, ‘Who else?’
ILUKA: Oh God! It’s like, ‘Who else?’ (Laughs). I wanna hate him but I kinda secretly love him. Four barbecue stores! Across Sydney!
HAPPY: So, we should hit up a barbecue store when you’re downplaying a gig. Otherwise, thank you so much for chatting to me.
ILUKA: No… what was your name, by the way?
HAPPY: I don’t think I gave it. I’m Mike, by the way! Lovely to meet you.
ILUKA: Lovely to meet you! Thank you so much!
HAPPY: Yeah, no worries. Be safe, make good choices. And I will see you at the Vanguard soon!
ILUKA’s new single Mess (feat Lime Cordiale) is out now! You can also catch ILUKA at The Vanguard, Sydney and Saturday, June 19 –from 7 pm – 11 pm. Tickets can be found here.
Interview by Mike Hitch
Photos by Four Minutes to Midnight
